blograpture

Rosh Hashanah is during repentence season(Yom Terua)

shockedword10 — Mon, 20 Apr 2009 02:38:50 +0000

Rosh Hashanah is still repentance season. It is the 30^th day of a 40 day repentence period, which began on Elul 1^st , goes through Rosh Hashanah, and then includes the 10 days of awe (another reprieve period) in which to repent before Yom Kippur.

On Yom Kippur the Book of Life is closed by the righteous judge in heaven, and those who have not been found worthy to be in that book have no further appeal to the Lord thereafter.

In light of Rosh Hashanah, the important point to take away is that this occurs while God is LONGSUFFERING, and awaiting the repentance; that is why the rapture cannot happen on Rosh Hashanah

It’s not until the High Priest, our Lord, “exits” the Holy of Holies (heaven), that he secures our TOTAL AND COMPLETE REDEMPTION and ATTONEMENT, thereby being able to present us to Himself as a spotless bride as in Ephesians 5:27 above.

http://www.godlikeproductions.com/forum1/message623797/pg1

Rapture in light of Judgment and Forgiveness

shockedword10 — Sun, 19 Apr 2009 17:03:55 +0000

CONSIDERATION OF RAPTURE

How does having a pre-trib rapture correspond to the different positions on judgment?

One scenario: When Christ comes back for believers at the rapture, they receive “rewards” at the bema, the timing or length of timing this takes is not focused on too much, but suffice it to say it’s probably finished during the 7 years of tribulation.

Thus,

how you qualify,
how you gain eternal life,
the importance of forgiveness
- for past sins
- and understanding how to have future sins forgiven,

These are all important and relevant to those who “go up” at the rapture.

The important question is what kind of judgment is believed to await all men.

Here’s some thoughts on why future sins are not automatically forgiven…: http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/futuresins.htm.

What this does not include, is further analysis on how that impacts the rapture yet.

Nevertheless, it makes you wonder, “Well could I miss out on the rapture…then what do I do?”

Question 1: Eternal Security: Are your future sins already forgiven before your commit them?

Here are 3 similar responses from some people:

No matter what you do as a child of God, you are forgiven. You say, “Murder?” Forgiven. “Stealing?” Forgiven. “Adultery?” Forgiven. “Worshiping Idols?” Forgiven.

Do you realize that when God forgives you, he forgives your past, your present and your future sin?

Some people struggle with that terribly. They think that God only forgives them of all the sin they committed until they were converted. I had a lady tell me one day, she said, “You know, I know my sins were forgiven when I accepted Christ, but I’ve done a lot of other sin. How am I forgiven for that?” Well, you were already forgiven.

On the flip side: Let’s look at:

Not Inheriting the Kingdom of God

…Paul (and others) were repeatedly teaching to the point of telling Christians they could die spiritually through sin and not inherit the kingdom of God:

–For if you live according to the sinful nature, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live (Rom 8:13)

–but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed. Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death. Don’t be deceived, my dear brothers. (James 1:14-16)

–The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God. (Gal 5:19-21)

First question…does the scripture ever talk about forgiving future sins or just passed?

Cleansed of Past Sin:
What the Bible teaches about past sins being forgiven at the point of repentance and a submissive faith in Jesus (Acts 20:21 cf. 26:20) is shown in the following Scripture:

But if anyone does not have them, he is nearsighted and blind, and has forgotten that he has been cleansed from his past sins. (2 Pet 1:9)
When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins (Col 2:13)
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just and will forgive us our sins and purify us from all unrighteousness. (1 John 1:9)
- ***Apparently, no person who believes what the security-in-sin teachers proclaim about this will confess his sins to God and renounce them to get purified, since he thinks they are already forgiven

Judgment in light of Forgiveness

For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins. (Mat 6:14,15)

Then the master called the servant in. “You wicked servant,” he said, “I canceled all that debt of yours because you begged me to. Shouldn’t you have had mercy on your fellow servant just as I had on you?” In anger his master turned him over to the jailers to be tortured, until he should pay back all he owed. This is how my heavenly Father will treat each of you unless you forgive your brother from your heart. (Mat 18:32-35) Other key verses:

If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left, but only a fearful expectation of judgment and of raging fire that will consume the enemies of God. (Heb 10:26, 27)

So then, dear friends, since you are looking forward to this, make every effort to be found spotless, blameless and at peace with him. (2 Pet 3:14)

….more from the site: http://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/futuresins.htm

The Rapture: Rooted in Catholicism

shockedword10 — Sun, 19 Apr 2009 16:15:37 +0000

Here is a link claiming that this theory which is believed so passionately by Protestants was originally a Catholic idea.

…The foundation of the rapture theory was laid over 400 years ago upon the specific orders of the Catholic Church. Every Christian needs to understand how this fabrication of error was designed to neutralize the great Protestant Reformation.

• If the facts of history were known by Protestants today who defend with such great emotion the rapture theory and the futurist antichrist doctrine, they would be horrified.
• Luther and his fellow reformers boldly identified the pope as the “man of sin,” and labeled the Catholic Church as the antichrist of prophecy.

****In response to those charges, the hierarchy assigned two Jesuit priests to develop counter- interpretations which would turn the onus away from the Catholic Church.

• In spite of the fact that the two men founded opposing schools of interpretation, their theories have survived to form the basis of most modern Protestant theology today.
• Not only did they effectively blunt Luther’s assessment of the papacy as the antichrist, but they cleverly divided and diluted the “protest” of all the churches which grew out of the Reformation movement.
Modern religious observers were astounded in January, 1984, when men like Billy Graham and Jerry Falwell meekly accepted and defended the establishment of United States political ties with the Vatican.
• Why could those famous Protestant spokesmen see no danger in being allied with the Church of Rome?
• Because they are deceived, along with millions of others, by the Catholic-contrived theories of those two priests which have almost eclipsed the historic, biblical position of the Reformers.
• If the spiritual descendants of Luther and Wesley now had the same doctrine which they taught, not a single Lutheran or Methodist would favor any kind of alliance with the papacy today.

Now let’s take a look at these two Spanish priests who flooded the sixteenth century with their counter-Reformation propaganda.

1. Alcazar of Seville applied all the beast prophecies to Antiochus Epiphanes, who lived long before the popes began to rule in Rome.
a. His system of interpretation came to be known as the Preterist School of prophecy.

2. On the other hand, Jesuit Francisco Rivera invented a system known as the Futurist School of interpretation. He taught that the antichrist was to be some future superman who would appear near the end of time and continue in power for three and a half years.

a. It is his clever, unscriptural theory which has been resurrected by modern evangelical Protestant Christians.
b. And today millions of Baptists, Methodists, Pentecostals, etc., hold this anti-Protestant concoction of the Jesuits as some kind of infallible doctrine.
c. Yet, those same denominations claim to be faithful supporters of Protestant theology.
d. Luther and other stalwart protestors against Catholic errors would be astounded if they were suddenly resurrected to hear what is being taught in the name of Protestantism.
e. In the early 1800s the futurist view of Jesuit Ribera passed through certain refinements and additions, including the seven-year tribulation and the snatching away of the saints.
f. For the first time, it was espoused by Protestant teachers who were seeking ways of reconciliation with Rome.
g. Through the influence and writings of John Nelson Darby of the Plymouth Brethren Church in England, the new doctrine spread to the United States.
h. During the middle and latter nineteenth century, it received its biggest boost from Cyrus Scofield, who incorporated it into the notes of his Scofield Reference Bible published in 1909. -Rendevous in space -a concerned Christian

The Rapture Plot (Paperback)

shockedword10 — Sun, 05 Apr 2009 23:36:46 +0000

Based on response from Gordon
Gordon // April 5, 2009 at 2:11 am | Reply (edit)

I thought this looked like a good read: The Rapture Plot

FINALLY: Don’t take my word for any of the above. Read my 300-page book “The Rapture Plot” which has a jillion more documented details on the long-hidden but now-revealed history of the dishonest, 179-year-old, fringe-British-invented, American-merchandised-until-the-real-bad-stuff-happens pretribulation rapture fad. If this book of mine doesn’t “move” you, I will personally refund what you paid for it!

Pre-Wrath-not Pre-Trib

shockedword10 — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:06:21 +0000

jesustheking wrote @ January 5, 2009 at 7:01 am

This is an excerpt from the person above who clearly explained his position on “Why I do not accept pre tribulation rapture, but rather pre-wrath.” Found on the following site: http://antipreterist.wordpress.com/2009/01/03/updating-the-rapture-concept/

First sickle is the Rapture of Christian believers, the 2nd sickle is God’s wrath
October 14, 2008 · No Comments

First sickle is the Rapture of Christian believers, the 2nd sickle is God’s wrath
Is Jesus’ Coming for his church and bride at Pre tribulation, Mid, or post tribulation Rapture? The timing of the rapture, the truth concerning Rapture, the main debates about Rapture’s timing

http://www.geocities.com/holyspiritliberty/rapture.html – Click

….

Does the Rapture of the Church occur Pre, Mid, or post Tribulation.

…

QUESTION 1. (READ: 1st Corinthians 15:51-56 before answering.)

Since this scripture is speaking on one of the mysteries of God (Rapture) and Paul says it will occur at the last trumpet.

· Where and when does this trumpet occur in the book of Revelation?

NOTICE: Paul doesn’t say first, second, or third trumpet, but last, which is the seventh.

Before you answer Question 1. read the below scriptures from Revelation. Pay special attention to the following key words while reading these scriptures. The key words are LAST TRUMPET and MYSTERY. Remember, in the book of Revelation the last trumpet is the seventh.

(Revelation 10:5-7) * (Revelation 11:15-16) * (Revelation 14:12-16)

^KJVRevelation 10:5 And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven, ⁶ And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: ⁷ But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.

^KJVRevelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever. ¹⁶ And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,

^KJVRevelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus. ¹³ And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them. ¹⁴ And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. ¹⁵ And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. ¹⁶ And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

QUESTION 2.

Where in relation to Revelation’s trumpet call is the last trumpet blown? (seventh trumpet)

· And how far into the tribulation does the blowing of the seventh trumpet occur?

QUESTION 3.

· Is this last trumpet, which Paul was speaking of, in 1st Corinthians the last trumpet described in Revelation? (Rememeber: The last trumpet in the book of Revelation is the seventh.)

If you do not agree what then did Paul mean by last trumpet, especially since we agree that this event called “Rapture” occurs at the end of the church age.

· If you do not agree that the last trumpet Apostle Paul spoke of is the same last trumpet as is spoken of in the book of Revelation, then why did Paul associate the term last trumpet as a description for defining a period of time when rapture is to occur? If you’re not in agreement then what last trumpet is Paul talking about if it’s not the last trumpet of the trumpet call of Revelation?

…

1 Cor 15:51-57

· 51 Lo ! I tell you a mystery. We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed. 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. 55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? 56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law. 57 But thanks be to God, which gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Commentary note on: 1 Cor 15: 51-52

· In verse 51 and 52 above we see the words Mystery, Last Trump and the word raised. Paul obviously is talking about a resurrection of believers here, otherwise he would not have used the word RAISED in respect to the dead. He is also talking about the end of the church age. With those things in mind lets look at God’s Word some more.

Revelation 10:5-7

· And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven, 6 And swore by him that lives for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be no more delay 7 But in the days of the trump of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he has declared to his servants the prophets.

Commentary on Rev 10:7

· Now here in Revelation 10 verse 7 we see the Word “Mystery” and the promise that when the seventh angel sounds his trumpet the Mystery of God would be fulfilled. We know the 7th angel in Revelation is the same one who blows the 7th trump. Here in Revelation 10:7 is only the promise, the angel is not sounding it here. Now lets look further into the Word of God.

Revelation 11:15-18

· And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, the kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign forever and ever. And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God, 17 Saying, We give you thanks, O LORD God Almighty, which is, and was, and are to come; because you have taken to thee your great power, and has begun to reign. 18 And the nations were angry, and your wrath has come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou should give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear your name, small and great; and that you should destroy them which destroy the earth.

Now in the scripture above we have the 7th Angel sounding his trumpet. Notice that it says in verse 18; “your wrath has come” speaking of God’s wrath and also “the time of the dead that they should be judged.” We know these are believers because it says the servants, the prophets and the saints. Also rewards are spoken about. You only give rewards to children in the kingdom. This is the resurrection Paul is talking about in 1st Corinthians. It occurs at the blowing of the Last trump, which is blown by the 7th angel. We also know these are believers in Jesus because the white thrown judgment resurrection for the rest of the dead, does not occur until Revelation 20.

One additional note on God’s wrath, notice from Revelation 11:15-18 above that until this scripture God’s wrath has not yet come. The time that it has come is announced in this scripture. All events that have occurred before this scripture are judgments and tribulations from God, but it is not his wrath. Let us continue with this scripture below.

Revelation 14:13-20

· 13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yes, says the Spirit, that they may rest from their labors; and their works do follow them. 14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. 15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, (Insert: Rapture starts here ) Thrust in your sickle, and reap: for the time is come for you to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. 16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

§ (Insert: God’s Wrath starts here after church is removed ) 17 and another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle. 18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in your sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God. 20 And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.

***First sickle is the Rapture of Christian believers, the 2nd sickle is God’s wrath

· Now this is where Rapture actually takes place, Rev 14:14-16 is the Rapture. This is the 1st sickle where Jesus comes and takes his Church out of the world and out of his impending wrath. Notice the word Harvest is used, Jesus also uses the word Harvest when explaining the tares and the wheat in Matthew.

· Now the next sickle (2nd Sickle) starts in 14:17-20, this is a wrath sickle. The 1st sickle is a Harvest sickle (Rapture). Be sure not to confuse these two sickles. Once again the 1st sickle in Revelation 14:14-16 is the Rapture. The second sickle in Revelation 14:17-20 is a wrath sickle.

The Bowl judgments begin right after this second sickle in chapter 14:17-20. As Jesus promised and Apostle Paul spoke, Jesus delivers us out of his wrath. Exactly as Paul was instructed and wrote to us by the power of the Holy Spirit.

I would like to point out one more thing to all reading, Jesus said in Mark Chapter 13 that the church age generation shall not pass away until all these things take place. What things? All the things he spoke of in Chapter 13. In Mark 13:37 Jesus also said this. “And what I say to you I say to all: Watch.” Jesus said for ALL to WATCH. He was speaking to his disciples and to us, Watch for what? Everything he spoke that would happen in Mark Chapter 13. Note Jesus did not say what I say to you I say to all, except for those who will be raptured before any of these things happen.

Jesus also talks about the tares (nonbelievers) and the wheat (believers). Jesus makes it clear they grow together until his coming. Jesus’ coming and rapture are in fact the same event. Here are a couple of those scriptures.

Matthew 13:29

· But he said, No; lest while you gather up the tares, you root up also the wheat with them. Matthew 13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, You gather together first the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Commentary on Matthew 13:29

· Notice Jesus says to the reapers to gather first the tares (nonbelievers) and bind them into bundles to be burned. Jesus does not command them to be burned at that very moment but rather be bound and gathered first for a future time that he will destroy them. This binding and separation will occur during the time of the Antichrist. Those who take the buying and selling mark of the antichrist will be bound and separated, to be burned after the church has been raptured.

Matthew 13:38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; 39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. Matthew 13:40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

1 Thessalonians 4:16,17

· “For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord.”

First, Please note that in both passages, a trumpet sounds before the dead are raised to life.

Now although this may seem quite simple, it is very important to observe this very simple commonality, because we’re about to compare these two passages to another passage that contains Christ’s own description of His second coming. Here it is:

Matthew 24:30

· “Then the Sign of the Son of Man will appear in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of Man coming of the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He will send His angels with the sound of a great trumpet, and they will gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.”

So in Christ’s own words, at His second coming a “great trumpet” will be sounded, after which His elect will be gathered together, “from one end of heaven to the other”.

This is exactly the same event that is described in the first two passages. In all three, a trumpet is sounded, and in all three, the ‘elect’, or believers, both dead and alive, are gathered to Christ.

To my brothers and sisters in Jesus Christ, Fear Not. Jesus promised to never forsake you, or leave you. He will provide protection during these times. Trust Him. Trust His Word. I have shown you the truth from Jesus’ Word. This is why I do not accept pre tribulation rapture, but rather pre-wrath.

Rapturo–Harpazo

shockedword10 — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:50:51 +0000

Here is a brief excerpt from the following article: “The beginning of something quite old” http://rapturerevelation.wordpress.com/2009/03/15/the-beginning-of-something-quite-old/

Now we make a quite large, non-conformist, leap ahead to an event of considerable division – the Rapture. The revelation of the rapture is an odd thing because the rapture isn’t in the book of Revelation – yes, that did sound like Willy Wonka. In fact, the word “rapture” doesn’t appear in the inspired word of God. The meaning is derived from the Latin word “rapturo” meaning “caught up“. The rapture of the saints is an amazing revelation intended to instill hope in believers enduring persecution. The premier verse concerning the doctrine of the rapture, 1 Thess 4:14-18, was written to a church to whom Paul said a few verses prior, “[You] received the word in much affliction (1:5)…we told you before when we were with you that we would suffer tribulation…(3:4)” The believers in Thessalonica were undergoing significant persecution at the hands of both Jew and Gentile antagonists. Paul wrote them because he had concern for their faith lest his “labor [was] in vain” (3:5). He was giving them a hope of the things to come. The doctrine of the rapture was meant to enable believers undergoing persecution to fix their eyes on their ultimate glory in Christ, not give them a false escapism mentality.

Additional notes on: “caught up”

· ^KJV1 Thessalonians 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. ¹⁵ For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. ¹⁶ For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: ¹⁷ Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. ¹⁸ Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

· 726 a`rpa,zw harpazo {har-pad’-zo}

· Meaning: 1) to seize, carry off by force 2) to seize on, claim for one’s self eagerly 3) to snatch out or away

· Origin: from a derivative of 138; TDNT – 1:472,80; v

· Usage: AV – catch up 4, take by force 3, catch away 2, pluck 2, catch 1, pull 1; 13

Other Sites on Revelation

shockedword10 — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:38:52 +0000

Rapture Revelation: http://rapturerevelation.wordpress.com/2009/03/15/the-beginning-of-something-quite-old/

Updating the Rapture Concept: http://antipreterist.wordpress.com/2009/01/03/updating-the-rapture-concept/

12 Reasons Not To Expect a Pre-Trib Rapture: http://onecanhappen.wordpress.com/2009/03/08/12-reasons-not-to-expect-a-pre-trib-rapture/

Why I care about the Rapture

shockedword10 — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:28:43 +0000

If there is a pre-trib rapture I want to prepare to make sure I’m in it. If there isn’t a pre-trib rapture, I want to plan accordingly.

If there is any rapture, it affects how scripture is read, what it means, and how your faith is practiced. In short, it comes up a lot and is unavoidable.

Besides the “me” factor…I care about YOU! Could YOU imagine if you had a false expectation and plans to get taken off of the earth before some “man of sin” is revealed, and then all of sudden disaster hits and you’re living in the midst of it!

It is much easier for someone to deceive YOU if you’re not expecting anyone to!

If Christ is coming back, then the real question is all about the “timing”. When does scripture tell us Christ is coming back…its important to start with what we knew prior to any “pre-trib” rapture being revealed to Paul.

We knew about Noah and Lot. (Matt. 24:37-39 and Luke 17:28-30)

· In Noah’s case, folks were warned, but went about their merry ways not stopping to give a second thought to the warnings. Then, for them, like a thief in the night, the wrath (in the form of water) came down and devoured them all. You’ll note that Noah was not removed from the earth, but was protected from God’s wrath. You should also note that Noah climbed into his protection just before the wrath was poured out.

· Likewise with Lot, he was not removed from the earth but rather taken to a place of safety. This happened the “day” the wrath was poured out.

Before we dive into all the verses and implications of the Rapture…please ask yourself…

“Do YOU care whether or not Christ comes back for YOU prior to the events in book of Revelation starting or does it not really matter that much to you and those you care about ?”

I care…hope this site helps understand both sides more clearly.

Verses–that seem to support Rapture

shockedword10 — Sun, 15 Mar 2009 04:27:19 +0000

Do these verses clearly teach the Rapture? Following, I will post an article on each one…

1 Thessalonians 4:13—17;

· ^KJV1 Thessalonians 4:13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep, that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope. ¹⁴ For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him. ¹⁵ For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. ¹⁶ For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: ¹⁷ Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

1 Corinthians 15:23, 51—58;

· ^KJV1 Corinthians 15:23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ’s at his coming.

· ¹ Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, ⁵² In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. ⁵³ For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. ⁵⁴ So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. ⁵⁵ O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? ⁵⁶ The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law. ⁵⁷ But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ. ⁵⁸ Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.

Philippians 3:20—21;

· ^KJVPhilippians 3:20 For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: ²¹ Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

John 14:1—3;

· ^KJVJohn 14:1 Let not your heart be troubled: ye believe in God, believe also in me. ² In my Father’s house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. ³ And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Luke 21:34—36;

· ^KJVLuke 21:34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares. ³⁵ For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth. ³⁶ Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.

Colossians 3:4

· ^KJVColossians 3:4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

What does this phrase mean? Gentiles blessed…

shockedword10 — Sat, 14 Mar 2009 22:26:01 +0000

It was known that the Gentiles would be blessed by the Messiah, but not

· that they would be full heirs and partakers of the promises to Israel,

· nor that the Church of the Body of Christ would be a “new man” comprised of neither Jews nor Gentiles,

o with its own promises and riches, the “unsearchable riches of Christ” (Eph. 3:8),

o independent of the “New Covenant” to Israel.

What does it mean that the Gentiles would be blessed by Messiah?

Does that mean they would receive life in the age to come?

Would they just get some temporal blessings in this life or could they some day count on being resurrected?

This is essential and important to clarify as many people say that the Old Testament speaks of them being blessed…just not to “THIS EXTENT”. Just not as “Full Heirs”.

How can you be a half heir? Aren’t we “inheriting” life in the age to come!! Sounds to me like you’re either in or out.

I think it’s important to nail down these promises.

The logical question is: “How does a gentile in the Old Testament make it past resurrection if he lived before Christ?”

Is he judged by his works? By his faith? Does his works show his faith?

We all fall short, we know there’s repentance, forgiveness, and change. The reason these questions are relevant is because whatever the prophets said about them being “blessed” must be compared to what the teaching of the “mystery” is and how it benefits them.

What more does the “mystery” give them that wasn’t already expected?

If anything, those who were the rightful heirs and had wonderful blessings are being told that what is available for people in this gap is better than what they were promised.

What future things changed for a good Jew that believes in Messiah now? Looks like just how you get there!!

Yet, in the same breathe it’s that Gentiles are “joint-heirs” with Israel and full-partakers of their promises.

You see my problem is identifying this secret. If you now have a secret administration and new entity that is made up of both Jews and Gentiles getting in on the original promises given to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob (which actually included both Jews and Gentiles anyway) how can you get them both access to the same ORIGINAL promise and teach that the benefits are greater now. They’d be the same because its the same promise!!

Seems like the only thing to change, was you can’t lose it and its not given to those who are faithful, but those who think and say Jesus is raised from the dead and that they want him to be Lord (regardless of your future actions verifying that).